tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post6811399245020464586..comments2024-03-16T05:00:38.826-04:00Comments on Egnorance: Nazism is State Darwinismmregnorhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11431770851694587832noreply@blogger.comBlogger87125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-54453310518289524902013-11-13T11:15:47.056-05:002013-11-13T11:15:47.056-05:00A big part of the problem here is that most of you...A big part of the problem here is that most of you, on whatever side, really do not understand the primary meaning of the word 'race' ... and, for that matter, the word 'species' -- I mean, this problem is even aside from the fact that far too many of you care only about squabbling, and certainly not about getting at the truth of anything.<br /><br />Most of you think that the <i>derivative</i> sense of the word 'race' -- much beloved of leftists-- is its primary sense/meaning. You'd be completely thrown for a loop to encounter such utterly correct usage as in the phrases "the race of fishmongers" or "the French race", because you mistakenly believe that 'race' is about biology, and particularly about skin-color. It is not about either; it is about classifying entities (which may or may not be organisms, and may or may not be humans) according to some identified commonality -- thus, "the race of fishmongers" refers to all those who earn their livings selling fish, and "the French race" is another way to say "the French as distinct from, say, the English".Ilíonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15339406092961816142noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-70224932705158454902013-11-07T01:40:04.046-05:002013-11-07T01:40:04.046-05:00Hoo,
No. That's not at all what I am getting...Hoo, <br /><br />No. That's not at all what I am getting at. The Nazis did indeed used mathematics and computers to calculate, for a single example, the numbers exterminated in the their gas chambers. But that does not mean we should abandon maths or computers. Mathematics did not, however, provide the twisted justification for genocide, merely the most efficient model. <br />The justification was to be found in Hitler's own words (above) about natural selection. <br />Does that mean we should abandon the theory for those reasons? No. I don't think so. <br />But, I think it would be wise to understand what the theory, when applied in a social setting (ie social Darwinism) to human beings (via policy) looks like. <br />It looks like Nazism. <br />Some (as Bach did on the next post) might argue that selective breeding has been around for centuries and hence the connection (clearly shown above) with natural selection is invalid. <br />That is a silly argument, but it does further illustrate the banality of the theory. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-81135837860043948922013-11-06T21:20:20.051-05:002013-11-06T21:20:20.051-05:00The Torch,
I've just finished the third. It&...The Torch,<br /><br />I've just finished the third. It's very good, with an enigmatic ending. I think you'll enjoy them.bachfiendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14752055891882312204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-17239568231281893222013-11-06T17:55:09.855-05:002013-11-06T17:55:09.855-05:00The phony admiral:
Troi: "You wonder why I o...The phony admiral:<br /><br /><i>Troi: "You wonder why I object against pedophilia?"<br /><br />Yes. Rather than dodging the question by asking me a question, answer the question. How can a meat machine with no free will be held responsible for its behavior, shaped as it was by genetics and social contingencies?</i><br /><br />That's a new question, and totally irrelevant. Who is "responsible" for The Fall? Was it Eve, or The Lord, shaped as she was by Him? <br /><br />Did you marry your Hispanic Catholic housekeeper? Is that why you signed up with the pedophiles?troyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05136662027396943138noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-5509577426491874062013-11-06T08:20:37.135-05:002013-11-06T08:20:37.135-05:00Crus,
So when Hitler said "You can put two ...Crus, <br /><br />So when Hitler said "You can put two and two together," he relied on math to further his ideology and you should be concerned, too. <br /><br />Right? <br /><br />HooAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-17626935160138683952013-11-06T07:48:58.366-05:002013-11-06T07:48:58.366-05:00Bach,
Hitler's inspiration are not what I am...Bach, <br /><br />Hitler's inspiration are not what I am discussing here. That would require much more than a blog post reply and is not as simple as 'Darwin' or 'scapegoat'; even as much as we can construe. <br />It is, rather, the justifications that he and his movement made I am concerned with.<br /><br />If you cannot pick out the natural selection blather from the ravings above (and there are entire chapters, speeches, interviews, and periodicals just like it!) then I would suggest having someone read the entire chapter of Mein Kampf (11) aloud to you. <br /><br />If you simply choose not to see it... well then it is you who are lying...to yourself. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-52782815496910519402013-11-06T04:58:08.480-05:002013-11-06T04:58:08.480-05:00No, I haven't. I'll have to try them.
The...No, I haven't. I'll have to try them.<br /><br />The TorchAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-54478098151755721772013-11-06T02:51:01.089-05:002013-11-06T02:51:01.089-05:00Crusader Rex,
Hitler was 'inspired' by na...Crusader Rex,<br /><br />Hitler was 'inspired' by nationalistic pseudoscientific genetics, but not by Darwinism. He persecuted the Jews as a scapegoat for Germany's defeat in the Great War for the mythical 'stab in the back'.bachfiendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14752055891882312204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-32180318569108314052013-11-06T01:07:30.487-05:002013-11-06T01:07:30.487-05:00Lies?
Let's see what Adolf Hitler himself sai...Lies?<br /><br />Let's see what Adolf Hitler himself said, shall we? <br />From Mein Kamp (Nation and Race, Chaper XI)<br /><br />"Any crossing of two beings not at exactly the same level produces a medium between the level of the two parents. This means: the offspring will probably stand higher than the racially lower parent, but not as high as the higher one. Consequently, it will later succumb in the struggle against the higher level. Such mating is contrary to the will of Nature for a higher breeding of all life. The precondition for this does not lie in associating superior and inferior, but in the total victory of the former. The stronger must dominate and not blend with the weaker, thus sacrificing his own greatness. Only the born weakling can view this as cruel, but he after all is only a weak and limited man; for if this law did not prevail, any conceivable higher development of organic living beings would be unthinkable."<br /><br />[...]<br /><br />"If the process were different, all further and higher development would cease and the opposite would occur. For, since the inferior always predominates numerically over the best, if both had the same possibility of preserving life and propagating, the inferior would multiply so much more rapidly that in the end the best would inevitably be driven into the background, unless a correction of this state of affairs were undertaken. Nature does just this by subjecting the weaker part to such severe living conditions that by them alone the number is limited, and by not permitting the remainder to increase promiscuously, but making a new and ruthless choice according to strength and health."<br /><br />"Historical experience offers countless proofs of this. It shows with terrifying clarity that in every mingling of Aryan blood with that of lower peoples the result was the end of the cultured people. North America, whose population consists in by far the largest part of Germanic elements who mixed but little with the lower colored peoples, shows a different humanity and culture from Central and South America, where the predominantly Latin immigrants often mixed with the aborigines on a large scale. By this one example, we can clearly and distinctly recognize the effect of racial mixture. The Germanic inhabitant of the American continent, who has remained racially pure and unmixed, rose to be master of the continent; he will remain the master as long as he does not fall a victim to defilement of the blood."<br /><br />On the Jews...<br /><br />"In the Jewish people the will to self-sacrifice does not go beyond the individual's naked instinct of self-preservation. Their apparently great sense of solidarity is based on the very primitive herd instinct that is seen in many other living creatures in this world. It is a noteworthy fact that the herd instinct leads to mutual support only as long as a common danger makes this seem useful or inevitable. The same pack of wolves which has just fallen on its prey together disintegrates when hunger abates into its individual beasts. The same is true of horses which try to defend themselves against an assailant in a body, but scatter again as soon as the danger is past."<br /><br />As you can see from his ravings, Hitler did not justify what he was about to do with pseudo scientific blather. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-81233225680203045572013-11-06T00:34:42.701-05:002013-11-06T00:34:42.701-05:00"i wonder how he determined which 'race&#..."i wonder how he determined which 'race' of cabbage was the favored one. i'm partial to red cabbage myself but surely that's all very subjective."<br /><br />The proof, as they say, is in the coleslaw! Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-59559984574205600892013-11-05T23:04:57.030-05:002013-11-05T23:04:57.030-05:00Hardly, naidoo.
John's monumentally stupid c...Hardly, naidoo. <br /><br />John's monumentally stupid claim was that the title of Darwin's book was "racist." And that he didn't have to read beyond the title to see that.<br /><br />Well, John is wrong. Darwin used the word <i>race</i> interchangeably with <i>species</i>. The title didn't refer to preferred human races, as John seemed to think. The cabbage example clearly illustrates that. <br /><br />And read Crus's comment. He seems to be the only conservative with a functioning brain here.<br /><br />Adios, muchacho. <br /><br />HooAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-57179827665299731972013-11-05T22:43:04.097-05:002013-11-05T22:43:04.097-05:00The Torch,
If you like mysteries and police stori...The Torch,<br /><br />If you like mysteries and police stories, have you ever read Barry Maitland? He's an Australian author who has a series set in London involving Scotland Yard. I'm on the third, and they're very good so far. The first is 'the Marx Sisters'.bachfiendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14752055891882312204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-88404596657185126312013-11-05T22:25:20.365-05:002013-11-05T22:25:20.365-05:00can we all just admit that darwin believed that bl...can we all just admit that darwin believed that blacks and monkeys were cousins? i suppose that's hard for people who are still clinging to the excuse that darwin really had a grudge against produce. i wonder how he determined which 'race' of cabbage was the favored one. i'm partial to red cabbage myself but surely that's all very subjective. <br /><br />naidooAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-78171484976853744272013-11-05T22:08:48.159-05:002013-11-05T22:08:48.159-05:00And why would you read a book from a known crackpo...And why would you read a book from a known <i>crackpot</i> like Charlie Darwin? He sounds like David Duke when he rants about blacks. Sheesh. And he's a male chauvanist pig, too!<br /><br />BenAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-57715095154769481502013-11-05T22:04:50.124-05:002013-11-05T22:04:50.124-05:00So what?
Well, for starters, I think he qualifies...<i>So what?</i><br /><br />Well, for starters, I think he qualifies as a crackpot. He's also deeply racist. He seems pretty jazzed about the coming age of the master race. Sound familiar?<br /><br />I think he and Hitler shared a lot of ideas about who's on top of the heap when it comes to races. In their shared view, some are barely more than monkeys, while others are blazing a path toward a more perfect man. Dare I say, an Aryan superman?<br /><br />If you put Hitler and Darwin in the same room, they'd agree on some pretty substantive issues. The question that remains is if Hitler somehow imbibed some of his ideas from Darwin. I think that's what the book is about, which neither of us has read. But you're absolutely sure that Hitler could not have gotten his ideas, which were so similar to Darwin's, from a book that was one of the most influential of the century into which he was born.<br /><br />BenAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-21893118697226419852013-11-05T20:54:52.055-05:002013-11-05T20:54:52.055-05:00Crusader Rex,
'You sure kicked the hornets...Crusader Rex,<br /><br />'You sure kicked the hornets' nest'.<br /><br />Telling lies tends to do that.bachfiendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14752055891882312204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-54481443324572990292013-11-05T20:54:37.313-05:002013-11-05T20:54:37.313-05:00Well Hoo, if you're too chickenshit to answer ...Well Hoo, if you're too chickenshit to answer my question, I'll just open it up to the floor. You know, I was asking you because I honestly wanted an answer. <br /><br />Heres' my question. Actually, there are three.<br /><br />(1) If we all arrived here through evolution, what proof do you have that all groups evolved equally?<br /><br />(2) Wouldn't that be an incredibly amazing feat? <br /><br />(3) So why would we all have the same IQ across all races and ethnicities? <br /><br />The TorchAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-48803049347493153882013-11-05T20:46:57.996-05:002013-11-05T20:46:57.996-05:00Or maybe your memory is faulty, Joey, and you you ...Or maybe your memory is faulty, Joey, and you you simply made up my Asian descent. <br /><br />HooAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-31067290630153579012013-11-05T20:46:54.698-05:002013-11-05T20:46:54.698-05:00I even asked where they fall into DARWIN'S rac...I even asked where they fall into DARWIN'S racial hierarchy! There's no way you could have possibly misunderstood that.<br /><br />JoeyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-3584975917847989732013-11-05T20:43:05.642-05:002013-11-05T20:43:05.642-05:00I didn't say that I believe that. I said that ...I didn't say that I believe that. I said that Darwin believes that. So thank you for proving that Darwin is racist.<br /><br />He clearly lists a hierarchy. Whites are on the top. They will go extinct too, because something more advanced will replace them, but he is clearly implying that they are among the "civilized races." They're on top. Perhaps there is another race there too because of the plural form, though he doesn't name which one. <br /><br />You must have lied to me then about being Asian. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-78809295294794344932013-11-05T20:34:18.338-05:002013-11-05T20:34:18.338-05:00Man.... I went and made Tacos for the gang, and no...Man.... I went and made Tacos for the gang, and now look at this thread. <br />You sure kicked the hornets nest, Mike. <br /><br />I don't really know where to begin....<br /><br />Let's try here:<br /><br />Hoo, <br />"Darwin wasn't calling to exterminate inferior human races. He was merely stating a fact that they were being exterminated. "<br />I would agree with that, judging by what I have read of his work. He is far less enthusiastic about these urges than Huxley or the young Wells, for example. But it must be noted, Hoo, that he believed these people biologically 'inferior' and justified the position scientifically. That is the core of suggestion: That others used those justifications to bolster their own far less neutral position on the matter. <br /><br />Torch, <br />"Says Crus. How do you deduce that from the quote? Does Darwin not want "inferior" races to fall away into extinction? "<br />I am not sure if this question is aimed at myself or Hoo. But I will attempt to answer it just the same. <br />I get the impressions I do from reading the entirety of his book 'Descent of Man'. It has been a while, I will grant; but, when I did read it through, the work itself seemed to be drenched with a kind of nihilistic futility. The genocides were predicted, rather than called for, so far as I can recall. The whole of his works had an air of the unavoidable about them. As or his personal feelings on whether it SHOULD happen and to whom by whom, I am far less certain. He came of as rather ambiguous. <br />It seemed to me that the impression he wanted to deliver is that such horrors would inevitably occur due to the very biology of man. One could look at this as a kind of preemptive excuse making, or alternately as a kind of Nietzsche-esque doom-saying. Either way, he wrote it for all to read. <br /><br />Mike, <br />"[...]the Darwinian understanding of man was like an enzyme-- it sped up the dynamics of racial hatred and anti-semitism astronomically, because it offered a scientific imprimatur to man's basest instincts. If mankind was to prosper, the strong must exterminate the weak. It is an imperative of the species-- science says so."<br />Precisely what I was also driving at. Darwinism (and similar theories such as those of Haeckel) was used as a justification for the various genocidal and eugenic programs of regimes like (and including) the Nazis. One only has to read Mein Kampf to see this justification in black and white. <br /><br />Finally on the paedophilia: The predation of prepubescent children (not teens) is abhorrent. It is a violation of innocence that creates the outrage, whether or not it is a biological urge in some very sick minded, evil people (as is sadism). They could resist the urge, but they choose (ie free will) to satiate it and in doing so succumb to one of the most vile temptations known to human kind. <br />As for the Virgin Mary... the title says it all. How old she was (teenager?) or whether that was culturally acceptable at the time is irrelevant. She did not have sex. She was not a 'victim' of anything during the Immaculate Conception. That she slept with God to conceive is a common (pagan rooted) misconception.<br /><br />I hope that addresses some of the points at hand....<br />Now to my coffee and something sweet. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-3304203370031446942013-11-05T20:10:11.365-05:002013-11-05T20:10:11.365-05:00Michael,
No, but traditional Europeans were happy...Michael,<br /><br />No, but traditional Europeans were happy to expel Jews (as the Nazis were considering doing by deporting them to Madagascar) or to indulge in violent pogroms when they needed a scapegoat in times of disaster, such as the Black Death.<br /><br />Hitler hated the Jews because he thought that they were traitors and harming the war effort. He thought exterminating the Jews would make Germany stronger and more united.bachfiendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14752055891882312204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-22563006654090148912013-11-05T19:52:19.181-05:002013-11-05T19:52:19.181-05:00Hoo once mentioned that he is of Asian descent. Th...Hoo once mentioned that he is of Asian descent. That makes sense. Hu is a common family name in China. Hu Jintao, for example.<br /><br />I wonder where Asians fall into Darwin's racial hierarchy. Possibly he considers them one of the civilized races. Race here is plural. He doesn't say. Where do they fall in the continuum between whites on the one hand and baboons on the other?<br /><br />JoeyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-23676039190826438112013-11-05T19:51:49.012-05:002013-11-05T19:51:49.012-05:00bach:
Traditional Europeans never saw Jews as an ...bach:<br /><br />Traditional Europeans never saw Jews as an inferior race to be exterminated based on biological science-- the slogan that Germany must protect itself by "Natural Selection, or the Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle for Life" is a fine precis of Nazi racial policy, that the full title of Origin of Species. mregnorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11431770851694587832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-20281945788589431692013-11-05T19:48:59.885-05:002013-11-05T19:48:59.885-05:00We know that you don't know much, admiral. How...We know that you don't know much, admiral. However, not everyone is at your level. <a href="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/15464b.htm" rel="nofollow">Catholic Encyclopedia</a> estimates that "Mary gave birth to her Son when she was about thirteen or fourteen years of age." <br /><br />HooAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com