tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post7052677024429644581..comments2024-03-16T05:00:38.826-04:00Comments on Egnorance: Ed Brayton: "...first class jerk Michael Egnor... [the] dolt... impose[s] his religion on others..."mregnorhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11431770851694587832noreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-46504684003059515032012-01-26T16:39:38.461-05:002012-01-26T16:39:38.461-05:00Ah, the reply devoid of any substance. How very pr...Ah, the reply devoid of any substance. How very predicable from the faith-addled brain of Don Austen. He can't say anything on the actual subject, so he just drool and spouts inanities.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-21507109616122326092012-01-25T10:18:31.847-05:002012-01-25T10:18:31.847-05:00"I don't believe there is a vast internat..."I don't believe there is a vast international conspiracy dedicated to eradicating religion from U.S. public life."<br />Eh? Non sequitor. <br />What the hell are you on about now? <br /><br />"You're in Strangelovian "steal our vital essences" territory there."<br />It is actually 'contamination our precious bodily fluids'. <br />Funny you should see yourself in the role of Mandrake. I imagine you more like a President Muffly or maybe even Miss Scott. <br /><br />"Communists have other things to worry about."<br />Worry? Again, you are having a conversation with someone else, or yourself. Maybe these are arguments for your father or some authority figure? I have no idea what you're on about. <br />Please tell me - no tell us all: What do Communists worry about? <br /><br /><br />"You still haven't substantiated your silly claims. I guess you think just saying these things are true (and like the Apollo 8 example....."<br />Face it, kid: You're just plain WRONG. <br />You can't have it both ways, either Aldrin's prayer is a prayer - or the banner is not. <br />Either prayers were said on / for each Apollo mission or they were not. They could not be unsaid, and there would be not 'controversy' if they were NOT said.<br />Just make up your mind.<br />As for the Apollo missions, I will leave it to our educated readers to discern that for themselves. They can read a book or two, watch a film or five, or research online to see what they make of that HISTORIC Christmas Eve broadcast from Apollo 8. <br />I do not need to spin it. <br />Nor do I need to educate you... but somebody sure does. Frankly, the education you need could be done in about 16 weeks...provided you're old enough. Post grad would be 24 months (min) of reality.<br />Then maybe - just maybe - we could begin to discuss rights and freedoms, faith, and even silly things like satire. <br />Till then - keep on arguing with yourself. <br />Infantile git.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-35180148845201427182012-01-24T21:46:29.194-05:002012-01-24T21:46:29.194-05:00"...the duly constituted referees have made t..."...the duly constituted referees have made the call and it is strike three for you." How many strikes until he is out? I know it's three in baseball, but I'm not sure what sport you're thinking of here. As any dim-witted nose-picking 4 year old will tell you, there are no referees in baseball. Not to put too fine a point on it, 23cal, but you're a drooling moron. Or as the umpires say in football, "You're out! Game, Set, and Match!!!"Don Austenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02960016492675743076noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-84330746788407613882012-01-24T21:26:56.988-05:002012-01-24T21:26:56.988-05:00Speaking personally, I think they should have just...Speaking personally, I think they should have just covered up the school prayer with pages torn from the new politically corrected version of "Huckleberry Finn." That would kill two wildly offensive birds with one stone. Peace out.Don Austenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02960016492675743076noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-64784435994801674722012-01-24T20:32:15.856-05:002012-01-24T20:32:15.856-05:00@crus,
[Am I sensing a new by-line for the blog, ...@crus,<br /><br />[Am I sensing a new by-line for the blog, Mike?]<br /><br />Good suggestion! I put it up.<br /><br />Thanks.mregnorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11431770851694587832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-2035325721467956332012-01-24T20:31:10.470-05:002012-01-24T20:31:10.470-05:00"Please clarify: You do NOT believe in commun..."<i>Please clarify: You do NOT believe in communists or communism and that makes ME crazy.</i>"<br /><br />I don't believe there is a vast international conspiracy dedicated to eradicating religion from U.S. public life. You're in Strangelovian "steal our vital essences" territory there. Communists have other things to worry about.<br /><br />"<i>Even if that was the official prayer of a single mission (it was not), it is far more prevalent and invokes the name of God in an OFFICIAL and PUBLIC capacity.</i>"<br /><br />Umm, no it isn't. It is an informal personal invocation.<br /><br />Let's see these "official mission prayers" you keep harping on.<br /><br />"<i>Well seeing as you are the anointed one who can lead us all to truth, I guess we'll have to take your word over Aldrin's. But that is only a single incident, oh anointed one.</i>"<br /><br />Aldrin's message was specifically vetted prior to the mission by NASA to ensure that it was not a prayer. Aldrin wanted an additional portion that was a prayer, but that was vetoed.<br /><br />"<i>You have forgotten, in your galactic calculations, the MANY other incidents - like the Christmas Even broadcast from Apollo 8. The FIRST manned mission to the moon. (Audio here)</i>"<br /><br />Which was not sanctioned by NASA, and for which the Astronauts drew substantial criticism. And which was the reason that Aldrin had to get his message approved before he could use it, and why it was specifically made <b>not a prayer</b>.<br /><br /><i>"Too funny for words"</i><br /><br />Take it up with Aldrin. His missives can be found at the Presbyterian Church where he was an elder.<br /><br />You still haven't substantiated your silly claims. I guess you think just <i>saying</i> these things are true (and like the Apollo 8 example, without understanding the fact that the prayer caused justified backlash, or that Aldrin's message was vetted so as not to be a prayer) means they are true.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-29815022659822060952012-01-24T20:30:30.690-05:002012-01-24T20:30:30.690-05:00@RickK,
[Yes, Michael does love it so when he get...@RickK,<br /><br />[Yes, Michael does love it so when he gets noticed by another blogger. And the good news doesn't stop there! He's now up to 19 members!<br /><br />You go, Mike!]<br /><br />Quality, RickK, quality.mregnorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11431770851694587832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-75256110079316811992012-01-24T19:23:02.237-05:002012-01-24T19:23:02.237-05:00"Yes."
Please clarify: You do NOT believ..."Yes."<br />Please clarify: You do NOT believe in communists or communism and that makes ME crazy. <br /><br />"You need to brush up on your facts. The official prayer was "Dear Lord don't let me fuck up." Very pious."<br />Even if that was the official prayer of a single mission (it was not), it is far more prevalent and invokes the name of God in an OFFICIAL and PUBLIC capacity. <br /><br />"Which isn't a prayer. "<br />Well seeing as you are the anointed one who can lead us all to truth, I guess we'll have to take your word over Aldrin's. But that is only a single incident, oh anointed one. You have forgotten, in your galactic calculations, the MANY other incidents - like the <a href="http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/lunar/apollo8_xmas.html" rel="nofollow">Christmas Even broadcast from Apollo 8</a>. The FIRST manned mission to the moon. (<a href="http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/image/apollo8_xmas.mov" rel="nofollow">Audio here</a>)<br /><br /><br />"Aldrin took prayers on paper with him, but brought them back. "<br />Too funny for words.<br /><br />"Some astronauts later took microfilm copies of the KVJ to the Bible, but they weren't paid for using government funds or given government sanction."<br /><a href="http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/image/apollo8_xmas.mov" rel="nofollow">Better send up the ACLU</a>!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-46971978248563840762012-01-24T19:03:57.140-05:002012-01-24T19:03:57.140-05:00Aw Gee Whiz, Mike.
Looks like the cool kids won&#...Aw Gee Whiz, Mike. <br />Looks like the cool kids won't be inviting us to the Eugenics themed dance to meet the 'females'. <br />I guess we just don't have enough facebook friends and blogger buddies to 'get on the in' with the pocket protector punk rockers. That's okay.... <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_HH_jher3c" rel="nofollow">We're through with being cool</a>, anywayAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-20945560652010665052012-01-24T18:47:31.326-05:002012-01-24T18:47:31.326-05:00Yes, Michael does love it so when he gets noticed ...Yes, Michael does love it so when he gets noticed by another blogger. And the good news doesn't stop there! He's now up to 19 members!<br /><br />You go, Mike!RickKnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-89749780558298576682012-01-24T18:46:38.004-05:002012-01-24T18:46:38.004-05:00Lunar landings? What the hell does that have to do...<i>Lunar landings? What the hell does that have to do with Internationalism? Are you trying to suggest that to believe there is a real alliance of hostile nations, and their respective intelligence services that put out propaganda and thereby use malcontents in other nations is the same as thinking the lunar landings were staged?</i><br /><br />Yes. You are in lunatic conspiracy theory territory, and you don't even realize it. <br /><br /><i>They also had an official PRAYER for each mission, said prayers on the moon (recorded), and even left microfilmed versions of prayers on the moon for posterity.</i><br /><br />You need to brush up on your facts. The official prayer was "Dear Lord don't let me fuck up." Very pious.<br /><br />Aldrin said this on the first landing:<br /><br />"<i>Houston, this is Eagle. This is the LM pilot speaking. I would like to request a few moments of silence. I would like to invite each person listening in, whoever or wherever he may be, to contemplate for a moment the events of the last few hours, and to give thanks in his own individual way.</i>"<br /><br />Which isn't a prayer. Aldrin had intended to say a prayer after this over the radio, but this was vetoed by Deke Slayton. Aldrin observed a private prayer (which is perfectly fine).<br /><br />Aldrin took prayers on paper with him, but brought them back. Some astronauts later took microfilm copies of the KVJ to the Bible, but they weren't paid for using government funds or given government sanction.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-75637894166087613682012-01-24T18:12:13.976-05:002012-01-24T18:12:13.976-05:00Only when I officially request them to, but they&#...Only when I officially request them to, but they're blue and cost quite a bit and so I better have an urgent need to OFFICIALLY get somewhere fast. <br />Besides rotor wings (even the usual 2) leave me a little nervous. Give me a fixed wing any day. <br />As for 9/11, you're chatting with a veteran combat officer of the Afghanistan campaign. <br />The answer is NO. I know who attacked us. I made war on them. Don't be ridiculous. <br />Lunar landings? What the hell does that have to do with Internationalism? Are you trying to suggest that to believe there is a real alliance of hostile nations, and their respective intelligence services that put out propaganda and thereby use malcontents in other nations is the same as thinking the lunar landings were staged? <br />That is just weird, Anon. <br />A little pronoid, too. <br /> <br />No. I do not think the lunar landings were faked.<br />Men DID go to and walk on the moon. <br />They also had an official PRAYER for each mission, said prayers on the moon (recorded), and even left microfilmed versions of prayers on the moon for posterity. <br />(Maybe you should send a lawyer to take those down!) <br />On the other hand: Yes, I do think Communism and Communists are real. I do think they intend to win the ideological long war, and I do think they use people (malcontents, pawns, students, idiots etc) to further their agenda in nations other than the one's they have established a regime in. <br />Communists and communism EXIST. <br />I have seen them and spoken with them. I even have photographs of / with them. <br />They are real. <br />Ditto for Islam and Muslims.<br />Sorry if that frightens you.... but it is, as they say, 'just the facts'.<br />I think you will find, however, that the hostiles themselves are quite unapologetic for their existence.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-35674769836824117252012-01-24T17:13:21.873-05:002012-01-24T17:13:21.873-05:00Or is it a long term function of a larger organ(s)...<i>Or is it a long term function of a larger organ(s) like the internationalists or even another cynical global movement?</i><br /><br />Are the black helicopters coming to get you too? Was 9/11 an inside job? The moon landing was a hoax?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-57990684161636449922012-01-24T13:00:38.184-05:002012-01-24T13:00:38.184-05:00"Endorsement and display of religious beliefs..."Endorsement and display of religious beliefs on public property by government agents occur everywhere and always." <br /><br />Well, not "everywehere", and there are a number of court cases that have stopped it from happening "everywhere". And, as soon as the Cranston school board comes to its senses, there will be one less place.<br /><br />I know of another lawbreaker who tried to use this same justification. He was a thief. His defense was, "People steal all the time, some of them get away with it some times, so I should get away with this time". I mean, just because O.J. got away with murder doesn't mean everyone gets to.<br /><br />It was goofy when he used it and it is goofy when you use it. It is like the same tired old, "But, it has been that way for so long." The thief tried that one, too. He said, "I've been stealing since 1961, when the prayer banner went up. You can't bust me now, or take the banner down, because we have both gotten away with it for so long."<br /><br />As the judge in the Cranston trial pointed out in his decision, "At any rate, no amount of history and tradition can cure a constitutional infraction." I understand YOU don't think it is a constitutional infraction, but you do not have the legal authority to make that call. The ones who DO have the legal authority to make that call have clearly made it in favor of separation.<br /><br />You can hold your breath until you are blue in face and kick your heels on the floor until they are sore, but the duly constituted referees have made the call and it is strike three for you.23calnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-88782193061256534722012-01-24T11:38:19.629-05:002012-01-24T11:38:19.629-05:00@TheDeuce,
The motivations of the individual mili...@TheDeuce, <br />The motivations of the individual militant/political Atheist are varied, I would guess. I would suspect a great of it has to do with latent adolescent desires and angst- to rebel against daddy and that kind of thing. But they are just tools. Pawns if you like. <br />What interests me is the larger picture of who is moving the pieces or using the tools, and to what end. Is it merely agitation and generated controversy to enrich and empower a few individuals, akin to a corrupt politician or preacher (ie the 'four horsemen')? Or is it a long term function of a larger organ(s) like the internationalists or even another cynical global movement? <br />I think we may be seeing both.<br />Useful idiots, sure. <br />But useful to whom? <br />Well the answer MAY be in the TYPE of idiot.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-65205797942747459102012-01-24T11:24:57.155-05:002012-01-24T11:24:57.155-05:00"first class jerk Michael Egnor... [the] dolt..."first class jerk Michael Egnor... [the] dolt... impose[s] his religion on others..."<br />Am I sensing a new by-line for the blog, Mike? :P<br />I think you may have hit a sore spot! <br /><br />"Atheists understand the danger that their censorship poses to their larger agenda."<br />They sure get sore when you point them out like that! <br />Good stuff. Spot on.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14739783974158130525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-59510566841051986652012-01-24T10:43:02.611-05:002012-01-24T10:43:02.611-05:00Without God we have no rights, because without God...<i>Without God we have no rights, because without God there is no such thing as rights. There is merely applied secular power. So we need to demand our First Amendment rights, particularly the right to acknowledge in our civic life that God is the source of our rights , because respect for the right of free expression-- civic and private-- is the basis for our nation, and the Christian understanding of man is the rational basis for that respect, and God is the only Source of our rights.</i><br /><br />The Constitution disagrees with you. The rights contained therein do not cite God as their source. Perhaps you should read the document some time.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-20728008618204197502012-01-24T09:42:33.610-05:002012-01-24T09:42:33.610-05:00Nobody actually, genuinely believes that the Const...<i>Nobody actually, genuinely believes that the Constitution forbids things like that school prayer mural.</i><br /><br />Except the judiciary (including the Supreme Court), most lawyers in the U.S., and a large proportion of the population. It violates established case law which is built upon the 1st and 14th Amendments. The reason you lose is not because of some shadowy atheist conspiracy. It is because most people agree that having schools promote religion via things like the prayer banner is a violation of the U.S. Constitution.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-79054255325721868562012-01-24T09:38:55.087-05:002012-01-24T09:38:55.087-05:00And yet no one has tried to close down churches. O...And yet no one has tried to close down churches. Or even said they want to close down churches. And the same people who are advocates of the separation of church and state go to great lengths to try to ensure that religious expression by individuals is protected.<br /><br />It seems difficult to treat your claims as anything but spurious hogwash in light of the actual actions taken by the people you are complaining about.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-36452893804109029102012-01-24T09:34:01.781-05:002012-01-24T09:34:01.781-05:00I'm referring to what your actions and attitud...I'm referring to what your actions and attitudes imply about what motivates you (which just happens to be the same authoritarianist hatred motivating most politically active atheists through history, unsurprisingly), of course, not what you've succeeding in accomplishing.The Deucehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09664665914768916965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-51534955379660143622012-01-24T09:23:30.502-05:002012-01-24T09:23:30.502-05:00I find his refusal to pretend that you atheists ac...I find his refusal to pretend that you atheists actually believe your convoluted, sophistic "interpretations" to be rather refreshing, personally. Nobody actually, genuinely believes that the Constitution forbids things like that school prayer mural (unless they've been lied to about it by other atheists and never bothered to look into the question themselves), especially not the people who argue it the loudest. Trying to rationally argue with an atheist on this matter is as pointless as trying to prove to a solipsist that other minds exist. It's impossible to have a rational argument with someone who refuses to recognize (or pretends to) the most basic facts of the matter. Better to expose your dishonesty, idiocy, and true motives to the public, and then marginalize your totalitarian worldview as much as possible.The Deucehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09664665914768916965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-71175123184478494912012-01-24T09:18:37.265-05:002012-01-24T09:18:37.265-05:00I notice that the churches are still open (and tax...I notice that the churches are still open (and tax exempt) and the ACLU fights frequently for the rights of people to engage in worship. I wonder what alternate reality you are living in in which the practice of faith in the U.S. is in jeopardy.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-14524556154994816232012-01-24T09:12:02.458-05:002012-01-24T09:12:02.458-05:00So why is Ed-- along with other godless gendarmes-...<i>So why is Ed-- along with other godless gendarmes-- spitting pea soup?</i><br /><br />The same reason the Soviets couldn't be satisfied with merely outlawing expression of religion. What really bothers the totalitarian mindsets shared by most atheists is that there are still so many people who still have internal beliefs that contradict their own, and they can't be happy and satisfied until they're certain that this is no longer the case (which can never happen of course).The Deucehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09664665914768916965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3555199390227912207.post-76815371145543364622012-01-24T08:25:58.596-05:002012-01-24T08:25:58.596-05:00Once again, Egnor smears on his clown makeup and a...Once again, Egnor smears on his clown makeup and announces to the world that he hasn't got the first clue about the meaning of the Establishment clause or Constitutional law.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com